Messages revealed by inquiry make for 'grisly reading' - former senior civil servant
Beth is now hearing from Lord McDonald, who was a former senior civil servant in the Foreign Office - he was also instrumental in the downfall of Boris Johnson after claiming the government was not telling the truth about Chris Pincher.
Lord McDonald says the messages published today make for 'grisly reading' - but adds that governance is always messy.
He says he has limited sympathy for those officials involved, because while it was "the biggest crisis that we faced for a century in public health", but on the other hand some of the things being said in writing should not have been put on record.
Moving onto the use of disappearing messages, Lord McDonald says he didn't and doesn't use the tool on his WhatsApp.
He said that those in Downing Street "should not" have been using the facility to erase what was being said between members of government.
One of the comments that stuck out from today's evidence came from the messages between officials, when Simon Case - the head of the Civil Service - said Boris Johnson "cannot lead".
Lord McDonald said that was "about the most awkward thing".
Mr Case also claimed that "government is not that hard". Lord McDonald says Mr Case probably regrets saying that - adding that he believes it does damage the reputation of the Civil Service.
